It Must Be More Than Charlie … Friday Cup O’Chiefs
One question about this football marriage between the Chiefs and Charlie Weis:
Is he bringing Tom Brady with him?
While no official declaration has been made by the organization, it seems fait accompli that Weis will become the team’s offensive coordinator. Football coaches are the ultimate example of not counting chickens before they hatch. There’s always a second or third thought, another bigger or better offer comes in or the family decides they don’t want to move to a new home. There’s always a chance this thing blows up.
Weis’ addition has been greeted with great excitement not only among Chiefs fans but around the NFL. It’s considered the perfect fit; an experienced offensive coordinator coming in and helping out inexperienced head coach Todd Haley. These guys know each other, having shared an office for three years with the New York Jets. Weis went on to New England where he won Super Bowl rings and worked around Scott Pioli.
Most importantly, he coached and developed Brady, either 1A or 1B on the list of the NFL’s best quarterbacks for the last decade along with Peyton Manning.
Weis spent eight seasons as an NFL offensive coordinator. When you look at the overall numbers, they are not very impressive. On average, those eight teams finished 25th in offensive yards, 11th in rushing yards and 25th in passing yards.
Only twice in eight years did a Weis coordinated offense finish among the top 10 offenses. Only once in eight years did a Weis offense finish among the top 10 running offenses and only twice did his offense finish among the top 10 passing offenses.
The best years of his offense came when Brady replaced an injured Drew Bledsoe as the Patriots starting quarterback during the 2001 season. That was the first of three championship seasons for Weis, Brady and New England. There’s no question the offense was one of the key factors in the championship victories.
And Brady was the key to the key. The Patriots passing game grew in productivity and stature with each season as Brady established his legend. There’s no question Weis helped in that development. It’s the reason he was hired by Notre Dame and the reason that Haley would like to bring him to Kansas City.
Other than Brady, there were other talented players who helped Weis when he was coordinating offenses for the Jets and Patriots. There were names like Curtis Martin, Vinny Testaverde, Keyshawn Johnson, Wayne Cherbet, Terry Glenn and Drew Bledsoe to work with. Right now, the Chiefs don’t have a player on the roster equal in stature or performance than any of those players.
If Weis comes to Arrowhead, he comes without Brady. Can he work the same magic with Matt Cassel?
The biggest reality that everyone involved in this situation must understand is that what happened in New England cannot be replicated with the Chiefs. Even if the franchise had Bill Belilchick as head coach and got Brady at quarterback, it would not be the same. Wasting time and energy trying to build Foxboro West is the fastest way to keep the Chiefs stuck at the bottom of the league.
Like so many of the people that have left the world of the Patriots, Weis wants to show it wasn’t just the situation, it was him. His first chance at Notre Dame did not work out. Now, he gets a second shot.
With his experience and ability and with the right intentions, the addition of Weis will be a big help to the Chiefs coaching staff. But the key will be his intentions. If he’s joining the Chiefs because he sees a chance to get in early to another building project that’s being orchestrated by a couple of guys he knows well, then that’s good.
If he’s getting in because he views Haley’s position as tenuous and Weis wants to be in the house to replace him should he bounced, then it’s not good.
No matter Weis’ motivation, it will be an interesting dynamic to watch between head coach and offensive coordinator. As Haley has shown, he doesn’t put off changing items or personnel that he’s not happy with. He holds nothing in or back. Reportedly, Weis has much the same personality.
That creates the potential for explosion. It also creates the potential for some very fine collaboration with the Chiefs offense. There’s no way that Haley will not be involved with the offense, its game planning, execution and play calling. Weis had better be able to handle that fact.
But there’s one fact that dwarfs the situation with Weis and the offensive coordinator position, and that’s talent. Without a big infusion of talented offensive performers it doesn’t matter who creates the game plan or who calls the plays.
When a team finishes 4-12, the problem cannot be laid at the feet of a coordinator or any coach.
The problem is not enough talented players.
Adding Charlie Weis as coordinator does not change that.
Here are the numbers of the eight offenses that Weis handled with the Jets and Patriots. The yardage totals are based on per game averages:
| Â Year | Â Team |
 Record |
 Playoffs |
Off. Yrds. |
NFL Rank |
Rush Yrds. |
NFL Rank |
Pass Yrds. |
NFL Rank |
| 1997 | N.Y. Jets |
9-7 |
 |
295.4 |
22 |
92.8 |
25 |
202.6 |
16 |
| 1998 | N.Y. Jets |
12-4 |
1-1 |
357.2 |
4 |
117.4 |
13 |
239.8 |
4 |
| 1999 | N.Y. Jets |
8-8 |
 |
297 |
25 |
122.6 |
11 |
174.4 |
28 |
| 2000 | New England |
5-11 |
 |
285.7 |
22 |
86.9 |
26 |
198.8 |
19 |
| 2001 | New England |
11-5 |
3-0 |
305.1 |
19 |
112.1 |
13 |
193.1 |
22 |
| 2002 | New England |
9-7 |
 |
317.8 |
21 |
94.3 |
28 |
223.6 |
12 |
| 2003 | New England |
14-2 |
3-0 |
314.9 |
17 |
100.4 |
27 |
214.5 |
9 |
| 2004 | New England |
14-2 |
3-0 |
357.6 |
7 |
133.4 |
7 |
224.3 |
11 |
| Â | Â |
82-46 |
10-1 |
316.3 |
17 |
107.5 |
18.8 |
208.8 |
15.2 |
| 2009 | CHIEFS |
4-12 |
 |
303.2 |
25 |
120.6 |
11 |
182.6 |
25 |
“MR. PIOLI & MR. HALEY: PLEASE PICK UP THE WHITE PAGING TELEPHONE”
Let’s see: the Chiefs need weapons on offense and they need a returner who can actually score after catching a kickoff or a punt.
Let’s see II: Joshua Cribbs says his time in Cleveland is done and he will not play again for the Browns.
Can 1 + 1 in this case = Cribbs to Chiefs?
Cribbs told the Cleveland Plain Dealer that he’s done with the Browns because the franchise now under the direction of new President Mike Holmgren made him a take-it-or-leave it offer on a new deal.
“It absolutely felt like the last time I’d be setting foot inside the building,” Cribbs said. “I feel like it’s over for me in Cleveland.”
Of the Browns’ contract offer that works out to an average of $1.4 million a year, Cribbs said it felt “like I’ve been betrayed and stabbed in the back. I’m not just insulted by the number, but by the fact they consider me just a kick returner. I’m so much more than that.
“There’s no way I’ll play another down for the Browns without the new contract. They won’t let me sit, because I have value. They’d be forced to trade me.
“I’m shocked they make me an offer like that after all I’ve done for this team. They told me to be the good soldier and prove it on the field and I did that. I can’t be told to wait again. I just don’t see it happening.”
ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE STORIES YOU CAN’T MAKE UP
The relationship between the Oakland Raiders and their former MVP quarterback Rich Gannon took another strange twist this week.
You’ll remember that during the season, the Raiders tried to have Gannon banned from their facilities as part of his preparation to handle the color commentary for the game broadcast on CBS. They were unhappy with public criticism of the franchise by the man who helped lead them to their last Super Bowl appearance.
But this week, Gannon offered an olive branch and some help.
“I did something yesterday that I can’t believe even I did,” Gannon said on his Sirius radio show on Tuesday. “I picked up the phone and I reached out to Al Davis. So I called Mr. Davis, I have not spoken with him yet, but I’m happy to help out in any way I can. I’d love to help JaMarcus Russell if he wants help. I’d love to help Tom Cable and that organization. It’s important. Listen, seven straight seasons where they’ve lost 11 or more games? Something’s not right.”
That offer was me with a typical Raiders response.
“It’s Rich that needs the help,” said Raiders senior executive John Herrera. “When he goes on a radio show offering Mr. Davis help, Tom Cable help, the Raiders help, maybe it’s Rich that needs the help.
“What does Rich Gannon think he has to offer that Paul Hackett (Oakland QB coach) can’t contribute, when he said himself that Paul Hackett is the best quarterback coach that he ever had?”
On Thursday, again speaking on Sirius radio, Gannon brought a close to his offer.
“It’s amazing. You try to just reach out to somebody and say something that maybe you can help a young guy and you get criticized for it. I’m not looking for work. I have plenty of jobs that keep me busy. People think I’m looking for a job. I’ve been offered jobs to get into coaching and to get into management. I have no interest in doing it.
“I was just really looking at a young guy that’s really struggled and just thought that I could reach out to help him out. Listen I’m not all the kings horses and I’m not all the kings men. I can’t put Humpty Dumpty together again. I can’t do that.
“I was just looking to figure out a way to go out there and share with them some of the things that helped me as a player and prepare and get myself ready not only for the season but for games each week. I’ve done it with Aaron Rodgers, and I’ve done it with quarterbacks in Tampa and Minnesota.
“But hey trust me; I won’t make that call again.”
SIGNINGS, HONORS, INJURIES & MOVEMENT AROUND THE LEAGUE
- NFC – named Cowboys QB Tony Romo offensive player of the month, Packers CB Charles Woodson defensive player of the month and Eagles returner DeSean Jackson special teams player of the month.
- BROWNS – announced that Eric Mangini would return as head coach in 2010.
- DOLPHINS – signed former Chiefs draft choice DE Brian Johnston.
- STEELERS – fired special teams coordinator Bob Ligashesky.
FROM THE PAGES OF CHIEFS HISTORY
On January 8, 1994, the Chiefs beat the Pittsburgh Steelers 27-24 in a wild-card game in the 1993 AFC Playoffs at Arrowhead Stadium. The Steelers jumped out to a 17-7 lead at half-time with the only Chiefs score coming thanks to a 23-yard TD pass from QB Dave Krieg to WR J.J. Birden. A 23-yard FG by Nick Lowery cut the Steelers lead to seven points and then the Chiefs tied it up o n a two-yard run by RB Marcus Allen in the fourth quarter. Pittsburgh grabbed the lead back thanks to a 22-yard scoring pass from QB Neil O’Donnell to TE Eric Green. The Chiefs got the ball back, but couldn’t move as the Steelers took over after a punt. Pittsburgh’s offense stalled, and that’s when the KC special teams stepped up. TE Keith Cash blocked a Pittsburgh punt and the ball was recovered by WR Fred Jones at the Pittsburgh nine-yard line. On fourth-and-goal, QB Joe Montana hooked up with WR Tim Barnett for a seven-yard TD pass that along with the PAT kick sent the game into overtime with just under two minutes to play. The teams traded possessions in the extra period, before Montana led the Chiefs on an 11-play, 66-yard drive that ended with a 32-yard FG by Lowery for the victory.
SAY HAPPY BIRTHDAY …
Born on January 8, 1983 in Magnolia, Mississippi was G Tre Stallings. He was selected in the sixth round of the 2006 NFL Draft out of the University of Mississippi. Stallings played two seasons with the Chiefs (2006-07), playing in two games.
Born on January 8, 1982 in Prague, the Czech Republic was OT Will Svitek. He was selected in the sixth round of the 2005 NFL Draft out of Stanford University. Svitek played three seasons with the Chiefs (2005-07), appearing in 16 games, including 13 games during the ’07 season with four starts.
Yeah we do need to improve the overall talent of the o-line and receiving core, but having Weiss takes pressure off Haley now trying to run the entire offense by himself. I don’t see Haley being a meadler. People read too much into Haley demeanor sometimes. Thinking he’s this controlling tirant that wants to do it all. Not true. Haley comes off to me as an humble guy that just want settle for as he would say Half ass. Certainly Weiss won’t be that, but since Haley is head coach expect him to be more involved in all phases of team game plan because thats his job.
The Raiders and Rich Gannon–what can you say? They took the axiom of not looking a gift horse in the mouth and filtered it through the cuckoo’s nest world view that is Al Davis’ mind so that now the horse’s owner is rebuked for making the offer.
There is nobody like him, not even in the Alice in Wonderland world we call Washington, D.C.
[...] It Must Be More Than Charlie … Friday Cup O’Chiefs-Bob Gretz.com [...]
From all I can tell, Weis brought a balanced attack in his Offenses. Good enough to win Super Bowls. Good enough for me.
For all those that bitch about our ownership/leadership…see Oakland Raiders, please. At least we have class. We may not be winning right now, but at least we have that. Oakland has neither.
For all the names being thrown around (by fans) as potential QB coaches…how about Gannon? “Not interested” Rich? Hmmm…sure sounded like it. If not “officially”, maybe just some mentoring. Cassel could use the help, for sure.
How cold is it…… the mayor’s wife is wearing shoes.
How cold is it…… The Chiefs won at Invesco Field, Denver…..so…..hell has frozen over.
Heard it and got me smiling on a cold day. Stay warm.
No other rumors? Has Weis signed yet? Crennel?
el cid,
Weis is still not “official”. But, you know how they are about announcing things “officially” these days. It was expected yesterday.
Last I heard on Crennel was that his agent said he would interview with the Giants next week. Also said that other teams are interested…including the Chiefs. So that would appear to confirm that the Chiefs are at least looking for a DC. But I bet that pissed Haley off…considering Pendergast is still “officially” our DC at the moment. At least, as far as we know.
Signing may be announced at close of business today. For some reason Pioli likes to make these announcements and then go home so no questions can follow, I had forgotten.
Maybe Pendergast will have to do for another year. Other than Crennel doubt Haley has much interest in others. He seems to gravitate towards people he is comfortable with (ie players from Ari). It may be a first year thing.
BobGretz spent quite a long time discussing the issue of what’s the deal with why Weis hasn’t been announced yet – but methinks the issue is more simple than that (money/contract details). Also, does the offensive coordinator have to go through the same off-season fitness program that his players do?
Boy, I don’t know now. With it out there in the press that the Chiefs are looking…I don’t see them NOT getting another DC now. Unless Haley can do some damage control with Clancy. I mean, how much are you going to work at your job if you know you’re gone anyway? It’s kind of turning into a bad situation. What if Crennel signs with the Giants? “Hey Clancy, since we can’t replace you with someone better, we’d like you to stay for another year…and then try again to replace you.”
Unless Penergast already knows all of this. Hard to say what goes on behind closed doors…and what all the “understandings” are. Because, the Chiefs wanted Crennel last year. So Clancy had to know he wasn’t the first choice.
“The Raiders and Rich Gannon–what can you say?”
Can we say MEND THE FENCES WITH RICH? Or did we conduct ourselves even worse than Al Davis has?
SG,
“Also, does the offensive coordinator have to go through the same off-season fitness program that his players do?”
ha, funny stuff
Good article bob, I think cribbs is that person that we need to sign to get this team over the hump…I for it 100% and dont care what it
cost..well nothing ridiculous that is
guess I guess Rich doesnt cherish his years here in KC since he loves is FAIDERS so much.
Without talent, it doesn’t matter who you bring in as a coach.
Having said that, if I were in Pioli’s or Haley’s chair right now, I’d be more interested in putting Crennel in charge of the D, than I would be interested in paying Weis the Big $$ I’m sure he’s going to demand. Crennel has the talent in place on the Chiefs D right now to make a real impact. A nose tackle, a linebacker and another good cover corner, and the Chiefs D could very well be ranked in the top tier of the NFL. Even without any notable acquisitions, the D can be made solid with a coach of Crennel’s resume.
On offense… where do you start? I disagree with Gretz’s assertion that the Chiefs have no one of star quality right now. Exhibit 1: Jamaal Charles. Nice place to start, IMO. With the possible exception of Cassel, Charles is it, though. The Chiefs have, if not the worst, then next to the worst O-line in the NFL right now, and you have to build ANY offense around at least a decent line. It all starts there. It furthers my opinion that Crennel would be where I’d spend coaching money right now. I think the Chiefs can get him cheaper than they can get Weis, and see a quicker return on their money. Spend offensive money on the O-line, and maybe another free agent in the caliber of Chris Chambers.
Just my humble opinion…
If I were Gannon I would try to be loyal to the team that gave you the shot to be a starter with…the team that helped you get the league MVP and you helped take to the Superbowl. He did far more with the Raiders (like it or not) than he did with KC.
ITS OFFICIAL HE SIGNED!!!
Oh yeah… and living in Indiana… I’ve seen first hand how Weis coaches without a winning pedigree above him. True, I don’t (and didn’t) think Weis was a good fit at the collegiate level, but, looking at his two QB’s — Quinn and Clausen — one has to wonder if he is as good at developing QB’s as the Brady Miracle would seem to indicate. Quinn has proven to be a bust, and I fear, Clausen will prove to be the same. (Look for Clausen to go, at best, 3rd round, probably lower) The NFL seems to be telling Weis they don’t like the QB’s he’s developed. Notre Dame’s O-line was mediocre as well; Clausen was running for his life against any decent D. Given whom Weis recruited during his 5 years at ND also gives me pause to wonder about his ability to identify talent as well. With the Chiefs’ offense being talent poor, one has to wonder whether Weis’ has the ability to pick out the right talent.
Again… just my humble opinion…
And as is often the case with punditry… All of my hot air amounts to nothing. We have Weis, for better or worse. Hope it’s on the better side…
I really wouldnt say Weis can not judge talent, getting the best players to N.D. was probably the toughest part of his job.
like you said we have him for better or for worse. if he is a bust, you cant blame this new regime for not trying and getting the “best” OC available right now. Its kinda like a 1st draft pick, hes is ranked 1st player to be picked in the draft, and you have the pick and you pcik him. Everyone thinks he the best available and so does the team, but it doesnt always work out that way.
but is still like it!
Indplschiefsfan
On your previous topic you said we need a nose tackle linebacker and another cover corner please oh please don’t forget to add a decent safety to that wish list. I think if we don’t get Berry Okung Suh or Trent Williams of OU they have made another critical error in there draft judgment. Any one think Adailius Thomas will be back with the Pats next year? Looking like Cribbs wont be with the Browns good point Bob if any one in the NFL needs a returner it’s KC. I think Rolando McClain would be a reach at number five when you could pick up some really solid O line. If Suh or Berry are not there go with a bookend tackle. To leave my comments on Wies I think anything is better than a full back pass to the QB and then maybe some sideline passes two or three times per drive in one game. Not saying Haley isn’t talented just perhaps a little overwhelmed. Come on Romeo you gotta sign on with KC.
Bob, I think it should be noted that while Weis coached Brady, he never coached with the great receivers (Moss and Welker came later) and he never really had an excellent back until 2004 when they got Dillon, and you’ll note that’s the year they lept in the rushing rankings.
So obviously that shows that talent is the key to getting your rankings up, but he also was able to take the limited talent that they did have before then and forge an offense together that was good enough to win games. Hopefully that translates here…
Great article Bob!
There’s no question more talent must be procured & developed. The greatest coach in the world can’t take a live snap…
The trick is the right mix of youth & veteran talent that will allow us to improve markedly, and keep doing so into the future.
There were MANY opportunities for big plays in this offense this year that were foiled because of a lack of execution whether by dropped passes, missed throws or missed blocks. Believe it or not, I feel we need more additional talent on defense than offense. We’ve got to have a better S & a significant infusion of LB talent that can play consistently with good tackling fundamentals.
Gawd, I love blogs…
I want to make clear that I’m not dogging Weis as an OC; I’m only trying to temper his achievements by looking at the system he was a part of. Let us not forget, like him or not, Belichek was ultimately the one pulling the strings. And, whether admitted to or not, was probably the one pulling 95% of the personnel strings. We must also remember that even in the so-called “dearth” years of NE offensive talent, they had one of the best D’s in the NFL. Which, conveniently, dovetails with my point about building your D first. A very good D will allow an average offense the ability to win games, or at least stay in games, a lesser D would let slip away. Even with Brady, and the last two years notwithstanding, NE’s success started on the defensive side, not the offensive side.
My worry is we get Weis, and not Crennel. With apologies to TimR, I couldn’t disagree more with your assessment of our D. We are MUCH closer on defense than we are on offense. Good point on the safety position though; I’d give up a linebacker for an impact safety now that it’s been brought up. So having spewed all of that on our D, why do I want the attention on D rather than O? See my first paragraph. Championships are, with few exceptions, built on D, not O. Get a top tier D, and suddenly, your offense looks better. Again, I’ll say it: With a few shrewd acquisitions, the Chiefs will once again be the defensive threat they were in their heyday.
As far as dealing with what we have… I certainly hope Weis and Haley don’t knock heads so much we have a bigger mess next year than we had this year.
Cribbs is tied to the Browns for the next few years. If he doesn’t want to play for them, he will have to retire. The amount the Browns would want in a trade, would be too much to give.
Indplschiefsfan says:
” Let us not forget, like him or not, Belichek was ultimately the one pulling the strings.”
Yes, Pioli did nothing in New England. It was all Belichick. Weis did nothing in New England. It was all Belichick. Crennel did nothing in New England. It was all Belichick.
This tired old argument that some people keep trotting out about Belichick being some sort of football God…that everyone around him just “road his coattails” and did nothing while BB did it all? Pure BS. Belichick was successful BECAUSE he had good people around him.
Would Cribbs be worth a second and a third pick, helluva a returner and could be that second running back Charles needs to back him up. What a combo that would be! Can you imagine the play action that would develop off of that running combo…..just sayin, that could really be worth it!!
Chances are Berry and Suh will be gone by the time the Chiefs pick unless they move up. Okung would be a solid pick and they should be able to get a quality WR in the second round. Fixing the line and surrounding Cassell with some playmakers should be the priority. Hopefully Crennel decides KC is a good fit and then we can work on fixing the D.
First of all, corner is not a big need for the Chiefs. You always want to upgrade at corner when you can, but we have some guys there.
There’s an old saying that fits the Chiefs right now: It’s not about the Xs and the Os, but the Jimmies and the Joes. The Chiefs need talent. Chiefs staff knows the Browns staff (all from NE tree). Talk to them about how Cribbs might fit in here. KC needs playmakers, and should offer high picks and pieces to get him. Since KC doesn’t have obvious person in mind at 1st pick, that might shake him loose. Holmgren doesn’t want to start his tenure in Cleveland dealing with a malcontent.
Chiefs need help at LB, OL, heck, you can’t even list all the positions.
I know this probably won’t get read… BUT…
To Mad Chief:
Believe what you will. And read things that aren’t there, while you do. I never said, nor implied, that Belichek is a “football god”. Your words not mine. Nor did I say Pioli did nothing, Weis, etc. etc. Again, your words, not mine.
My only point is, Belichek, IMO, has the last word a vast majority of the time in that organization. How do I reach that conclusion? NE is still a pretty damn successful organization despite the fact the good coaches are cherry picked by other teams for “better” opportunities. What’s the one constant at NE over the last several seasons (besides Brady)? Belichek.
Don’t let your emotions and animosity towards Belichek overpower your objectivity Mad Chief.